rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 10, 2019 18:01:50 GMT 7
Note, same type of new plane as crashed in Indonesia October 2018. "The Latest: Ethiopian Airlines says 32 Kenyans among dead" ... A statement from the airline on Sunday morning said the Boeing 737 crashed around Bishoftu, or Debre Zeit, some 50 kilometers (31 miles) south of the capital, shortly after taking off at 8:38 a.m. local time. Ethiopia's state broadcaster says all passengers on the Ethiopian Airlines plane that crashed shortly after takeoff from Addis Ababa are dead. The airline has said 157 people were thought to be on board the flight to Nairobi on Sunday morning. Broadcaster EBC says the passengers included 33 nationalities. The cause of the crash of the new Boeing 737-8 MAX plane is not immediately known." www.yahoo.com/news/latest-ethiopian-airlines-says-157-aboard-crashed-plane-085100900.htmlFrom slightly earlier article "Ethiopian Airlines Nairobi flight crashes with 157 onboard Airline cannot confirm number of casualties after Boeing 737-800 MAX crashes 40 miles from Addis Ababa" www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/10/ethiopian-airlines-says-kenya-flight-with-157-onboard-has-crashed
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Mosha
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Post by Mosha on Mar 11, 2019 14:16:59 GMT 7
Ethiopian, Cayman, Airlines, and China have grounded the Boeing 737Max.
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Mosha
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Post by Mosha on Mar 12, 2019 12:26:00 GMT 7
Singapore have banned the aircraft type from it's airspace.
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Post by rgs2001uk on Mar 12, 2019 13:03:08 GMT 7
Singapore have banned the aircraft type from it's airspace. Has Trump sent the warships yet?
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rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 12, 2019 18:25:21 GMT 7
I stumbled over a German language article where it was mentioned that the engines used in the 737 MAX8 were meant for a bigger plane and might be a bit too powerful requiring more (software?) control. Will try to find the article again.
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rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 12, 2019 20:49:52 GMT 7
Reference to MCAS and the CFM Leap 1B engine originally being developed for the Airbus 320NEO. Seems the engive might be too big physically leading to the need to move the engine more to the edge or even before the wing. Of course it's still too early to say much. "Boeing hatte das MCAS in der erst seit 2017 ausgelieferten Max-Version der altbewährten 737 eingebaut, da das Flugzeug an entscheidender Stelle von den Vorgängerversionen abweicht: Die neuen spritsparenden Triebwerke vom Typ „Leap 1B“ des Herstellers CFM International wurden ursprünglich für den neuen Airbus 320NEO entwickelt und haben größere Durchmesser als ihre Vorgänger mit ursprünglich 1,54 Metern. Damit jedoch passten sie nicht unter den Flügel der etwas kleineren und niedrigeren Boeing 737. Um das Triebwerk mit seinem Turbinendurchmesser von 1,75 Metern überhaupt verbauen zu können, hat Boeing die Aufhängungen nach vorne verlängert – die „Leap 1B“ hängen nicht unter, sondern vor dem Flügel." www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article190130091/Absturz-von-737-Max-8-Turbine-wird-zu-Boeings-Achillesferse.htmlThe German article also refers to "Flightradar24 data regarding the crash of Ethiopian Airlines flight 302" www.flightradar24.com/blog/flightradar24-data-regarding-the-crash-of-ethiopian-airlines-flight-302/
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Mosha
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Post by Mosha on Mar 12, 2019 21:58:31 GMT 7
UK has banned it but I read the EU said the anti stall program could not be used in EU airspace.
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rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 12, 2019 22:12:19 GMT 7
and just as a humorous intermezzo to this tragic disaster, here Trump's views "U.S. President Donald Trump on Tuesday complained that modern planes are becoming too complicated for pilots, as countries around the world ground the Boeing 737 Max 8 after a deadly crash in Ethiopia. "Airplanes are becoming far too complex to fly. Pilots are no longer needed, but rather computer scientists from MIT. I see it all the time in many products. Always seeking to go one unnecessary step further, when often old and simpler is far better," Trump wrote on Twitter. He continued: "Split second decisions are....needed, and the complexity creates danger. All of this for great cost yet very little gain. I don’t know about you, but I don’t want Albert Einstein to be my pilot. I want great flying professionals that are allowed to easily and quickly take control of a plane!"" www.politico.eu/article/737-max-8-boeing-crash-donald-trump-bashes-airplane-technology-dont-want-albert-einstein-to-be-my-pilot/
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me
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Post by me on Mar 13, 2019 9:35:47 GMT 7
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me
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Post by me on Mar 13, 2019 9:44:50 GMT 7
Reference to MCAS and the CFM Leap 1B engine originally being developed for the Airbus 320NEO. Seems the engive might be too big physically leading to the need to move the engine more to the edge or even before the wing. Of course it's still too early to say much. "Boeing hatte das MCAS in der erst seit 2017 ausgelieferten Max-Version der altbewährten 737 eingebaut, da das Flugzeug an entscheidender Stelle von den Vorgängerversionen abweicht: Die neuen spritsparenden Triebwerke vom Typ „Leap 1B“ des Herstellers CFM International wurden ursprünglich für den neuen Airbus 320NEO entwickelt und haben größere Durchmesser als ihre Vorgänger mit ursprünglich 1,54 Metern. Damit jedoch passten sie nicht unter den Flügel der etwas kleineren und niedrigeren Boeing 737. Um das Triebwerk mit seinem Turbinendurchmesser von 1,75 Metern überhaupt verbauen zu können, hat Boeing die Aufhängungen nach vorne verlängert – die „Leap 1B“ hängen nicht unter, sondern vor dem Flügel." www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article190130091/Absturz-von-737-Max-8-Turbine-wird-zu-Boeings-Achillesferse.htmlThe German article also refers to "Flightradar24 data regarding the crash of Ethiopian Airlines flight 302" www.flightradar24.com/blog/flightradar24-data-regarding-the-crash-of-ethiopian-airlines-flight-302/I believe the larger engine did need moving the engines forward and this changed the thrust axis leading to the need of trimming to be done automaticly to counteract this. It seems this trim (out of the pilot's control and only controlled by one of the autopilot's inputs is the problem.
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rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 13, 2019 20:15:33 GMT 7
A number of pilots are said to have reported problems with MCAS on Boeings 737 MAX8 months ago. On the government website they described incidents which occurred in the start phase of a flight. "Mehrere Piloten sollen schon vor Monaten von Problemen mit der MCAS-Steuerungssoftware bei der Boeing 737 Max 8 berichtet haben. Auf einer Behörden-Webseite beschrieben sie Zwischenfälle, die sich in der Startphase ereigneten. ehrere US-Piloten sollen bereits vor dem Absturz der Boeing 737 Max 8 in Äthiopien ernsthafte Bedenken an der Sicherheit des Flugzeugs geäußert haben. Auf der US-Behörden-Webseite „Aviation Safety Reporting System“, auf der Piloten freiwillig und anonym Fehler melden können, befinden sich mindestens fünf Beschwerden aus der jüngeren Zeit, die sich mit dem Verhalten des Autopiloten während der Startphase befassen. Zuerst hatte zuerst die US-Zeitung „Dallas Morning News“ darüber berichtet." www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article190227649/Piloten-zum-Boeing-Autopiloten-Ich-habe-zuerst-gedacht-ich-habe-einen-Fehler-gemacht.htmlSee also www.documentcloud.org/documents/5766398-ASRS-Reports-for-737-max8.html#document/p10/a486269
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Post by rgs2001uk on Mar 13, 2019 20:42:37 GMT 7
and just as a humorous intermezzo to this tragic disaster, here Trump's views "U.S. President Donald Trump on Tuesday complained that modern planes are becoming too complicated for pilots, as countries around the world ground the Boeing 737 Max 8 after a deadly crash in Ethiopia. "Airplanes are becoming far too complex to fly. Pilots are no longer needed, but rather computer scientists from MIT. I see it all the time in many products. Always seeking to go one unnecessary step further, when often old and simpler is far better," Trump wrote on Twitter. He continued: "Split second decisions are....needed, and the complexity creates danger. All of this for great cost yet very little gain. I don’t know about you, but I don’t want Albert Einstein to be my pilot. I want great flying professionals that are allowed to easily and quickly take control of a plane!"" www.politico.eu/article/737-max-8-boeing-crash-donald-trump-bashes-airplane-technology-dont-want-albert-einstein-to-be-my-pilot/I am with the Don on this one.
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siampolee
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Post by siampolee on Mar 13, 2019 20:57:34 GMT 7
If memory serves me correct at the time of the Falklands conflict many problems were encountered by naval gunnery offices when their computers were down as said officers could not calculate target ranges and angles to enable them to shoot over the horizon. Also, problems were experienced in combat by pilots who could fly by wire but not the seat of their pants.
As a result, old fashioned training schemes were resurrected as a result of those problems. Service personnel were retrained to think for themselves and manually operate weapon systems and fly aircraft as opposed to relying on modern electronics etc.
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rubl
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Post by rubl on Mar 13, 2019 21:17:28 GMT 7
and just as a humorous intermezzo to this tragic disaster, here Trump's views "U.S. President Donald Trump on Tuesday complained that modern planes are becoming too complicated for pilots, as countries around the world ground the Boeing 737 Max 8 after a deadly crash in Ethiopia. "Airplanes are becoming far too complex to fly. Pilots are no longer needed, but rather computer scientists from MIT. I see it all the time in many products. Always seeking to go one unnecessary step further, when often old and simpler is far better," Trump wrote on Twitter. He continued: "Split second decisions are....needed, and the complexity creates danger. All of this for great cost yet very little gain. I don’t know about you, but I don’t want Albert Einstein to be my pilot. I want great flying professionals that are allowed to easily and quickly take control of a plane!"" www.politico.eu/article/737-max-8-boeing-crash-donald-trump-bashes-airplane-technology-dont-want-albert-einstein-to-be-my-pilot/I am with the Don on this one. Unfortunately there would be a public outcry if a plane had to make a short stop again every few hours. There's a lot of technology in a plane which simply can't be controlled by a two or even four man crew. Of course, since Donny suggested it, may I reminded people I did have a few semesters of Aerodynamics while studying Mathematics in Delft. I think that qualifies me for a well paying job as pilot. Assuming we don't go back to older, less sophisticated planes.
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Post by rgs2001uk on Mar 13, 2019 21:22:10 GMT 7
I am with the Don on this one. Unfortunately there would be a public outcry if a plane had to make a short stop again every few hours. There's a lot of technology in a plane which simply can't be controlled by a two or even four man crew.Of course, since Donny suggested it, may I reminded people I did have a few semesters of Aerodynamics while studying Mathematics in Delft. I think that qualifies me for a well paying job as pilot. Assuming we don't go back to older, less sophisticated planes. If you want the honest truth, if the public at large knew the truth, they wouldnt fly again, nothing more than flying guinea pigs.
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